Date: Fri, 19 Jun 1998 17:15:55 GMT
From: Mark Goodacre <M.S.GOODACRE@bham.ac.uk>
To: Antonio Jerez <antonio.jerez@swipnet.se>,
    crosstalk@info.harpercollins.com
Subject: Re: Thomas/Q project (Jerez)

Antonio wrote:

> Here are my findings. Sorry for being a bit late, but I have
> been tied quite a lot to the Television these days since the
> soccer world championship is going on right now in France.

Me too.  England for the World Cup!  With that un-academic outburst 
out of my system, one or two comments:

> 50) Q  16:17      Th 11[K] 
> 
> Does this verse really belong to Q? A saying related to this one is
> found in all Synoptics.
> 
> Th 11 "This heaven will pass away, and the dead above it will pass
> away". 
> 
> Mark 13:31 par. " Heaven and Earth will pass away, but my words will
> never pass away." 

There is probably enough agreement between Matthew 5.18 // Luke 16.17 
to warrant considering as Q.  The IQP had no question over this and 
reconstructed as follows:

    Q 16:17 But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass away than
    for [] one stroke of the law to <<lose its force>>. 

But there is a genuine question over how far this is a Q // Thomas 
parallel rather than a triple tradition // Q parallel, or a 
non-parallel.

> 52) Q2 17:20      Th 3[A]
> 
> The last part of this saying is only found in Luke. I don't
> know how they have managed to put this in Q. My own
> guess is that Luke made it up himself.

IQP returned ?Q17.20? which means that there was some doubt as to 
whether it could be included in Q.

> 55) Q  17:23-24   Th 113[K]
> 
> This Thomas logion has little in common with Luke 17:23-24
> and the parallels in the other synoptics. 

IQP reconstructed Q 17.23-24 as follows:

    Q 17:23 <<And if they>> say.. to you, Look, [he is in the
    wilderness], do not go out; Look, [he is in the inner rooms], do
    not follow them. 

    Q 17:24 For as the lightning comes [from the east] and [shines
    as far as the west], thus will be the [<day>] of the Son of man. 

> 57) Q2 19:26      Th 41
> 
> Th 41 "Whoever has something in his hand will receive more and
> whoever has something will be deprived of the little he has."
> 
> Mtt 13:12 "Whoever has will be given more, and he will have an
> abundance. Whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken
> from him."
> 
> Luke 19:26 "I tell you that to everyone who has , more will be
> given, but as for the one who has nothing, even what he has will be
> taken away.
> 
> Luke 8:18 "Whoever has will be given more; whoever does not have,
> even what he thinks he has will be taken from him."
> 
> My comment: 3. Luke 8:18 appears to be closest to Thomas.

This is complicated by the existence of two more parallels:

    Mattt. 25.29, parallel to Luke 19.26, and so the 'strict' Q
    verse

    Mark 4.25, parallel to Luke 8.18 and Matt. 13.12.

So Luke 8.18 (above) is really triple tradition, so the judgement 
here should probably not go in favour of Luke's version of the Q 
saying as being closest to Q here.

All the best

Mark
--------------------------------------
Dr Mark Goodacre       M.S.Goodacre@bham.ac.uk
  Dept of Theology, University of Birmingham
Homepage: http://www.bham.ac.uk/theology/goodacre

--------------------------------------

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